Tag: interview

In the late 21st century the remains of the human race are crammed into the Habitats: vast artificial space stations; hotbeds for crime and madness policed by private security firms.

When a routine drug bust goes wrong, no-nonsense Investigator Bridget Kurtis finds herself in a life or death struggle with a new sect of cultists. But evidence begins to point to something far more sinister going on behind the scenes… 

The latest story in the atmospheric, sci-fi thriller from Dan Abnett and I.N.J. Culbard is underway in 2000 AD with Brink: High Society.

In the last incredible collection, Bridge was investigating the possible sect crimes on Galena Hab, and ended up uncovering something far bigger in the process. And hanging over it all, there’s still the, as yet unexplained, issue of Mercury simply disappearing.

Richard Bruton caught up with Dan Abnett to talk ‘High Society’ and where they’re taking Bridge to next…

I don’t know how much you want to give away of the story in ‘Skeleton Life’ that saw Bridge investigating possible sect crimes on the new build habitat Galena – but, can you give us some idea of what readers can expect from ‘High Society’?

Dan Abnett: This is the follow up investigation, as they try to track the things they learned in book two back to the heart of it. We enter the world of the privileged few in Brink society, and we do so via an expected angle (in contrast to the previous two stories, this case is ‘undercover’). Ian and I have really enjoyed fleshing out another aspect of the “world” of Brink.

Brink book one was very much the police procedural and buddy cop tale, with a sci-fi and cultish twist. Book two was veered more into Nordic Noir realms; introspective, hidden agendas on both sides and an underlying threat that is still not yet revealed. Where are you taking us with book three, ‘High Society’, in terms of the overall thematic feel – and will we finally learn what happened to Mercury in this volume?

DA: As I said, undercover. Deep undercover. And there are some big answers, but of course SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER Mercury Event SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER

When we talked about Brink: Skeleton Life, we talked about the summary top-line of your work, so Brink was something along the lines, in my words, of True Detective meets Outland, and you described your other works together in similar fashion; “New Deadwardians was “The Walking Dead meets Downton Abbey”, Wild’s End was “The War of the Worlds meets the Wind in the Willows” and Dark Ages was “Kingdom of Heaven meets Starship Troopers”. So, how are you de-scribing Brink: High Society?

DA: Oddly, we were off and running with such energy this time, bursting with ideas, we never summed it up… but I guess “Upstairs Downstairs meets The Devil Rides Out” (or Night of the Demon). In an SF context, naturally 🙂

You’ve talked of Brink initially being a trilogy, with ‘High Society’ as the final part, but also the possibility of continuing it, as both of you are really loving working on Brink. So, if the series will continue past volume three, have there been any necessary changes to the saga?

DA: This is a pretty hefty piece of punctuation for the trilogy, but we have several really big, fresh ideas that could take the story (in the sense of the world and what’s going on) further. So this chapter is exactly what it was always going to be – nothing got revised. But composing with this story allowed us to see more clearly what possibilities could follow.

Would it be true that the reaction you’ve received with Brink, with its slower pace, concentration on character and dialogue, means that it’s the sort of strip that some don’t think ‘belongs’ in 2000 AD?

DA: Yeah. Almost universally… people didn’t expect it to ‘fit’ and then were caught up in it. We were the same, to be honest – we could both see it defied most of the conventions of 2000 AD (which are good conventions, BTW, and allow for a really wide range of things). But Brink’s pace particularly was very ‘un-2000 AD”. We hoped it was still very much in the spirit of 2000 AD (which is why we pitched it!) and are delighted the readers have embraced it.

With the art for Brink, there was a real shift in ‘Skeleton Life’ from the closed down, claustropho-bic spaces on the habitats in book one. The Galena build was a huge, open environment, and Ian’s art and colouring shifted massively to accomplish this. Are we going to see a similar tonal shift with the artwork on Brink?

DA: Can I just say here, in order to convey the ‘environmental duality’ that is the basis of this book, Ian’s done some very clever, very subtle work with scale and panel-by-panel composition in the storytelling.

Finally, the most important question, how big a role does Louis Armstrong get in this one? And I’m assuming Frank, Bing, Grace, and the rest of the gang will all be in there somewhere?

DA: Ah, I hoped the big surprise that this chapter was a musical would catch people out, but I see you’ve already guessed our big showstopping number “Who wants to be a Vovek spawn? I do!” Of course, ‘high’ has another meaning too…. 😉

Brink book one and book two are available as a bundle from the 2000 AD webshop, while ‘High Society’ continues in this week’s 2000 AD!

Welcome to Brit-Cit, where the Justice Department has its very own Psi-Division. One of these Brit-Cit Psi-Judges is Lillian Storm, cursed/blessed with powerful psychic abilities, including being able to talk to the dead.

It tends to make her just a little bit grouchy.

Created by Leah Moore and John Reppion, Storm Warning first appeared in ‘The Relic’ in Judge Dredd Megazine  #361-#366, with artist Tom Foster.

Lillian Storm has now returned with a new adventure beginning in the massive milestone Megazine #400, which is out now.

You can catch up with the first series of Storm Warning in the Brit-Cit Noir collection, available from the 2000 AD shop and Richard Bruton chatted with Leah and John, along with artist Jimmy Broxton, who joins the Moore/Reppion team for this new adventure.

With a new Storm Warning beginning in the Megazine, what can you tell us about the return of Psi-Judge Lillian Storm?

John Reppion: The story is a four-parter called ‘Over My Dead Body’. It sees Judge Storm back on her own turf in Brit Cit proper, and in the middle of a little bit of time off in fact. Of course, she’s never really alone… not with her entourage of ghostly orphans to keep her company.

By necessity, the first story, ‘The Relic’, dropped us into Lillian Storm’s story, as a somewhat grouchy Brit-Cit Psi-Judge on a mission to recover an ancient mystical object. Will this new tale flesh out more of Storm’s origin and background?

JR: Well, we filled in the basics of how she got her powers at the start of ‘The Relic’ (via the magic of flash back), so we’re hoping that readers have an understanding of her abilities already. If not, they’ll soon pick it up. ‘Over My Dead Body’ throws up a few more ideas about the practicalities and potential inconveniences which someone who can see and talk to the dead might encounter. Sometimes, day to day, you might prefer not to, you know?

With Storm Warning being set in Brit-Cit, it opens things up, story-wise, in ways a Mega-City One tale doesn’t necessarily allow you. So, is it an attraction of Storm Warning and Brit-Cit that it gives you a little more leeway with storylines?

Leah Moore: Definitely. I think when you are working on characters and in worlds that were created the same time you were born, it’s impossible not to feel a little adrift in the vastness of the continuity. By working in Brit-Cit, we get to play with all the fun Judge stuff, but bring a bit of a weird old England to it. It’s fun to see Storm interacting with a spirit world that is centuries old, and using her Psi powers to solve those mysteries as a judge.

In the first Storm Warning story, ‘The Relic’, we definitely saw things cropping up with a Lovecraftian horror feel, something both of you are very familiar with. And it seems to me that Brit-Cit, given it’s reputation as the occult centre of the world of Dredd, is a perfect vehicle for these sorts of tales. Is it something we’ll be seeing more of in this new Storm Warning?

JR: If I use the words “Folk Horror” someone is going to sigh and roll their eyes, but the horror and supernatural in Over My Dead Body is a bit more down to earth. It’s about the very British versions of ghostliness and haunting we sometimes take for granted. The weird history buried beneath our paving slabs; the phantoms who tread and re-tread the seemingly silent corridors of our institutions, our schools, and our workplaces day after day after day.

One important change this time round is the artistic contribution of the great Jimmy Broxton, replacing series co-creator Tom Foster. The last time we spoke on the 2000 AD blog you mentioned this new Storm Warning was in preparation with Tom.

JR: The story we mentioned and which we wrote for Tom is actually following on immediately after this one. That’s called ‘Green and Pleasant Land’.

How do you think Jimmy’s art has kept the incredible look that Tom brought to that first series, and what does it add?

JR: It’s a bit of a rare treat to see a character you’ve created drawn by a different artist – to see the subtle (or not so subtle) changes they make to the original and their world. Tom did a fantastic job of creating Judge Storm and expressing her (not exactly friendly) personality, but it’s also great to see how Jimmy has interpreted the character. No one who enjoyed ‘The Relic’ is going to be disappointed, trust me.

Jimmy, your last work for 2000 AD was Hope with Guy Adams, where you were working with a combination of tight noir realism and fantastical magical effects and layouts. Are you working differently on Storm Warning?

Jimmy Broxton: To a certain degree yes, but mainly on a technical level as SW is in colour, which means a lot of storytelling aspects can be handled chromatically. My art these days is very impressionistic, details are often merely suggested, hinted at almost, the reader’s eyes fills in the gaps and take up the slack, which I hope brings them into the story, this is of course a completely different approach to the one that Tom takes, which is technically dazzling and incredibly precise, but I think it’s a testament to how strong the characters and the world of Storm really are that two such contrasting visions can follow one another.

How did you approach creating the visuals for Storm Warning?

JB: I wanted to up the ante on this run, focussing even more on design and consistency of character, facially and in terms of body language. Science Fiction demands quite a bit of world building, I was very keen to make my version of Brit-Cit as convincing as possible, I had great fun designing vehicles and buildings and wild costumes etc, also, it’s Britain, so it’s always raining, there are puddles everywhere, which affords wonderful opportunities to play with light and reflections. I tried to imagine Bladerunner as if it were filmed in the East End.

And how does the collaboration between yourself and the Moore/Reppion team work?

JB: Their scripts are fairly tight, very clear, so no need to ask for any clarification etc. This helps me a great deal, allowing me to basically do my own thing visually, Leah and John’s scripts include precise directions for panel shape and arrangement, typically I ignore them! I tell the story exactly as written, but I often add panels, move things around, change the viewpoints and so forth. All this is in the service of the story, in comics art, that is by far the most important thing. I rarely do layouts, instead I create scenes in individual panel form, then I compose them together at the end, adjusting, crafting, basically editing the page, balancing the blacks, negative space and so on , making sure the most important aspects of the story are to the fore.

Finally, Leah, I’m sure I speak for everyone at 2000 AD and all comic fans out there when I say how glad it is to see you getting better after the rather traumatic events of earlier this year. Hopefully your recovery is well under way now and you’re beginning to feel a lot better?

LM: Thank you so much. Yes I am feeling much better, and it could have been much, much worse. For some reason, I suffered a Subdural Haematoma and yet came out of it without a profound loss of capacity, either mental or physical. I am a bit slower and creakier than I was, and it sometimes takes me a while to find the right word, or a name (please remind me if I look panicked at cons!) but otherwise I am completely me. The loss of my wonderful sister-in-law Dawn on the day of my brain injury was so cruel, and I cannot overstate my admiration for how John and his family coped with it on top of all the chaos and worry caused by my hospital stay. I’m so glad I’m still here to see it all. Hug your loved ones. Mend your differences. Life is precious and unbelievably short.

One thing to come from that horrible time is a renewed sense of the generous and kind nature of comic fans. How did it feel to be of the receiving end of so many small acts of kindness from so many?

LM: Oh, it was incredible. I’ve never felt anything like it. The outpouring of support from our friends and colleagues and readers has been a huge part of my recovery. How can you not feel better with so much care and love and good wishes sent your way? Andrew O’Neill’s Just Giving campaign raised a truly humbling amount of money. An amount that has meant we could take the summer holidays easy and enjoy some precious family time, and that means we can ease back into work without having to go full pelt right off the bat. I can’t believe how lucky I have been, that my injury is healing so well, and that we have been allowed these weeks to adjust to it. I thank everyone from the bottom of my heart. Comics people are 100% the best people. I’m going to start work again as soon as the kids go back to school and I can’t wait to get stuck in. Whatever brain I have left, I promise you I’m going to be making comics with it!

Storm Warning: Over My Dead Body continues in Judge Dredd Megazine #401 – out on Wenesdsay 17th October!

Fiends of the Eastern Front was a blood-curdling tale of warfare with bite. It first appeared in Progs 152-161 in 1980 when creators Gerry Finlay-Day and Carlos Ezquerra told a tale of a mysterious squad of Romanian soldiers, fighting alongside the Germans in the chilling conditions of the Eastern Front. The full story is revealed in full through the diary of Hans Schmitt, telling the terrifying tale of Romanian Hauptmann Constanta and his squad of blood-sucking nightmare stormtroopers, who cut a bloody swathe through the enemy, no matter which side they were on.

Subsequent appearances from Constanta came in ‘Stalingrad’ by David Bishop and Colin MacNeil (Judge Dredd Megazine #245-252, 2006) and ‘Fodder’ by Hannah Berry and Dani K (2000 AD Free Comic Book Day 2016). There have even been crossovers, including a fleeting one with Judge Dredd (‘Helter Skelter’ by Garth Ennis, Carlos Ezquerra, and Henry Flint, 2000 AD #1250-1261, 2001) and Durham Red (The Scarlet Apocrypha: Red Menace by Dan Abnett and Carlos Ezquerra, Judge Dredd Megazine #4.17, 2002), proving that, through time and space, an immortal vampire has a habit of surviving no matter what.

But, in the very speacial 2000 AD Prog 2100 (on sale 26th September), we finally see the return of Constanta in Fiends of the Eastern Front: 1812. What new nightmares will this new tale of the horrors of war and the war of horrors reveal? Richard Bruton sat down with writer Ian Edginton and artist Dave Taylor for the answers.

Fiends of the Eastern Front is a strip with a reputation belying its few appearances. In a comic that was so futuristic, setting a strip back in time and mixing war story and classic horror seemed somewhat revolutionary. Do you remember it when it was first in 2000 AD back in 1980?

Ian Edginton: I do remember it quite vividly. It came out of left field for 2000 AD, which at the time had primarily established itself as a science fiction comic. Nevertheless, it still had that antiestablishment sensibility that characterised 2000 AD but also harkened back to the classic British war comics that I grew up reading – Valiant, Victor, Hotspur and Warlord. Vampires fighting during World War 2 seemed like such a cool idea and then there was the added twist that you were on the side of German soldier Hans Schmidt as he locked wits with Constanta and his men. Getting you to empathise with the enemy was very 2000 AD!

Dave Taylor: When Ian mentioned it I knew I’d read it but didn’t have a clear memory until I found some of Carlos’ illustrations and BAM! I was right back in my youth. I can’t say it had a huge impact on me, it was up against such fond favourites as Dredd and Strontium Dog, I’m a sci-fi nut you see, but it was so unusual, so twisted and typically weird that I would have lapped it up. I’d been a classic 70’s kid, fascinated by war, had a regiment of Action Men and assorted kit, so anything war related, though taking second place to science fiction, was warmly welcomed.

The original was set in WWII on the Eastern Front and brought a vampiric bite to war stories with Gerry Finlay-Day and Carlos Ezquera doing a fine job bringing us, as the cover to Prog 152 tells us, “Not the horror of war, the war of horrors”. What can you tell us about this new Fiends of the Eastern Front: 1812 and the return of Constanta?

IE: The war of 1812 was a perfect fit for the story. Napoleon’s Grande Armee rolled into Russia with an army of around 600,000 men. They weren’t just French but there were Poles, Austrians, Italians and even some Irish. They were an unstoppable juggernaut, or so they thought. Pretty much every encounter they had with the Russians they won, with the Russians retreating – but they didn’t count on Russian tenacity and bloody mindedness. The Russians burnt their own towns and villages, farms, crops and livestock, depriving the French of provisions. When he reached Moscow, Napoleon expected there to be a delegation to surrender the city to him. Instead no one turned up and they’d set parts of the city on fire. There weren’t rules of war as far as the Russians were concerned.

With the savage winter setting in, his men starving and demoralised, Napoleon’s men were in retreat and being harried by packs of Cossacks which is where we come in. Something supernatural is also hunting them. French officer Major D’Hubert is obliged to join a certain Romanian Captain Constanta and his men in tracking down and killing this predator. The Romanians had long been oppressed by the Russians so it was natural that they’d ally themselves with the French but of course Constanta has his own agenda. It’s already been established in the previous stories that there are vampires and golems around but Dave and I intend to reveal more of this supernatural world.

DT: The first thing you need to know is that this is possibly Ian’s best writing. He’s outdone himself. This reads like something Kubrick or Wells directed. It’s poetic, rich, filled with feel and craftsmanship. It’s proper literature!

The near immortal nature of Constanta certainly opens up the strip to a world of stories, with potential settings in both the past and the future. I know it might be too early to answer this, but, have you thought about yourselves continuing with Fiends in the future and, if so, where would you like to take Constanta?

DT: I can see Ian becoming very attached to Constanta. I can tell he’s having a lot of fun in this universe and so I can imagine he’ll want to do more, explore the character more deeply and see where it takes him…as long as it’s a front and it’s East of something.

IE: Funnily enough I’m writing another Fiends story at the moment that’s being drawn by Tiernen Trevallion. I can’t say too much as it features something of a cracking crossover but I think people are going to enjoy it! There are also stories covering Constanta’s back-story in the works. In the original Fiends story and the later ‘Stalingrad’, Constanta was going to great pains to conceal knowledge of his presence. I want to know why? Who or what is he trying to hide from? We’ll delve into that, his former human life and how or why he became a vampire?

Dave, thus far, Fiends of the Eastern Front has had a spectacular artistic pedigree, with first Carlos Ezquerra and then Colin MacNeil adorning the pages. How did you approach the strip artistically, given that the two styles thus far are both different from each other and so distinctive?

DT: I always take each job as a new task and never read it with an artistic style in mind. It’s not until I’ve soaked up the script that I start thinking about the best way to tell the story visually. I never get hung up on what’s gone before…well, I did on Batman…and, yeah, I did on Dredd…but maybe I’m more comfortable in my skin these days! The style I’ve gone with makes sense to me and both Ian and the mighty Tharg are very happy with it, so hopefully the readers will agree. I’ve done a few jobs in pencil, without ink, and this story cried out to be textural and gritty so a pencil style was ideal for it.

With your style, we’ve talked before about it being a very European style, with obvious influences from Moebius, amongst others. It’s also a very distinctive style in the pages of 2000 AD. Have you made any changes to your art for this new Fiends series?

DT: I don’t think this is like anything I’ve done on Dredd or Anderson, that’s my Mega-City style and that alone. It’s a totally different approach, from the design stage to the finished page on this. It’s always the story that is the most important aspect, not the ego of the artist, and so I didn’t think “This’ll have to look like my Dredd stuff or folk might not like me any more!”

IE: Dave has brought a very strong look to this series. I know he’s often thought of as being mainly a science fiction artist but his artwork on this series is amazing. I thought that he’d hate me for all the historical reference I loaded him with, not to mention all the horses he’s had to draw but in all honesty, I think this is some of his best work to date. People are going to love the way it looks.

Ian and Dave, you last worked together on the Judge Lamia story in Judge Dredd, only her second appearance, but one that really resonated with readers. Any news on when you’ll be returning to this fascinating MC-1 character?

IE: There’s definitely more Judge Lamia stories to come. Now we’ve teamed her up with the ghost of Judge Lola the first thing they’ll do is try to find out more about how she came to be a ‘death herder.’ They’ll be plenty of off-world hijinks and horror!

DT: I’d love to get something out next year, which is entirely possible.

The results look fantastic, so how does your creative process and the relationship between writer and artist work for you?

IE: The process is pretty seamless. We get on well with each other so there aren’t any problems. Occasionally Dave will suggest a better layout for a page so I’ll tweak the panels or dialogue accordingly.

DT: The only difference was the reference sourcing for life in 1812. Ian included some references in his script, which was very helpful and gave me a good idea of how to fill out the other reference needed. Other than that it’s exactly the same: both of us in a cave dressed as ladies smoking the finest cigars and supping Absinthe. Same old.

Finally chaps, what can we look forward to from you both in the future?

DT: We’ve talked a lot about future projects and have a few plans firming but nothing I can talk about, outside of our Cave Ladies series, obviously.

IE: There’s more Kingmaker, Scarlet Traces and Brass Sun coming up for 2000 AD as well as a second Iron Maiden: Legacy of the Beast series for Heavy Metal.

The landmark 2000 AD Prog 2100 is out now and features a new 10-part Judge Dredd epic, ‘The Small House’, with Rob Williams and Henry Flint returning to long-form Dredds for the first time since they wrapped up their incredible Titan saga.

“There is a very big moment in Dredd’s world coming. We’re dealing with it here. But I can’t say any more than that” – That’s just one of the things writer Rob Williams had to say about events in ‘The Small House’ in an interview you can find in Prog 2100.

It’s a series that promises to tie up many of the threads from Williams’ Dredd work that have been in play from Trifecta, Titan, and Enceladus. It could well be the biggest thing to happen to Dredd, The Justice Department, and Mega-City One since Day of Chaos, following up on the mysterious secret team that Dredd’s been running in the background for the last couple of years.

In the pages of Prog 2100, Richard Bruton chatted with both Rob and Henry about what we can expect from ‘The Small House’, but there was so much more than would fit in the pages of the Prog. So here we offer something of a ‘DVD extras’ section, with all the fascinating stuff that didn’t make it into Prog 2100, where we talk all things Dredd with Williams and Flint…

What do you think it is that keeps Judge Dredd so fresh through the years and leads to each new generation picking up the strip?

Rob Williams: It’s probably the different voices and visuals and the weekly nature of the strip. Necessity means that new stories keep rolling through, largely by different people using the template set by Wagner, Grant, Mills and co. And it’s sci-fi that allows you to reflect the our current world. The news is always a fresh source of material for Dredd.

[With ‘The Small House’] I wanted to do a Dredd that confronts the nature of the Judges. The fact that we’re telling stories about what is basically an authoritarian regime. if you’re going to portray these characters as heroes – and the Judges are, sort of – I think you have to be honest about, well, fascism too. It’s a fine line. There’s a lot of real-world politics that I felt, needed a bit of refection in Dredd’s world. Fascism’s on the rise. We probably have a responsibility if we’re being creators of Dredd to show that there’s a cost.

‘The Small House’ features the return of a certain tea drinking Judge, but you’ve also got the separate storyline with another character that’s become hugely popular, the magnificently bad SJS Judge Pin, in your Dredd stories with Chris Weston, the Bolland to Flint’s McMahon, as they were recently described. What’s happening with Judge Pin?

RW: Chris and I have future plans for Pin. We know the end of that story. We just need to get Dredd there. She’s a really intriguing character. An SJS serial killer who’s been working unknown for years. So many Judges die on the streets, she can cover her bodycount and no one is aware.

Rob, the Titan saga (Titan & Enceladus) was your first big solo outing on Judge Dredd, although, of course, you’d both already been heavily involved in MC-1 (and with Henry) with Low Life.

RW: Yeah, I think it’s something you have to build to. Dredd’s initially very daunting to write. You feel the weight of all those great stories you grew up reading, and also it is so very easy to see him, and write him, as a robot – which leads to very limited stores. After writing him for a while I kind of felt like I was ready to write a story about the man. Which is why it was called ‘Titan’ – that’s referring to Joe, and that’s what Aimee Nixon wanted to rip down. To destroy his legend and prove to him that he was just a killer using the badge and uniform as an excuse. I’m not entirely certain Aimee wasn’t right about that.

Also, Titan was originally going to be a Low Life story about Aimee dealing with life up in the prison. But I thought it was a lot more interesting if it was a Dredd and Aimee turned out to be the bad guy. Which was her journey all along.

You’ve both been involved in the creation of various 2000 AD characters over the years, including Dirty Frank and Aimee Nixon, who both played a major role in Titan. How does that creative process work?

RW: Low Life came about because, if I remember right, Matt Smith asked if I’d like to do an undercover Judge Wally Squad strip. I wanted to make the lead character a hard-edged female – someone who’s ‘super’ power was that she was a great liar. Henry drew her with this broken nose, which was perfect. Dirty Frank showed up on a whim as a background character. Henry drew him to resemble Alan Moore. But Frank just had energy on the page from day one. He sort of demanded more room in the story. That was totally unplanned.

Titan and Enceladus was also the final arc in the Aimee Nixon chronicles you began back in Low Life. How long ago did you envisage this ending for the character?

RW: I’d never intended Aimee to end up dying up on the Enceladus moon or part becoming an alien ice spider creature. Weird where stories go. Aimee was always The Big Man – the Low Life’s mystery big bad. I always had her journey to be she eventually realises that she’s far more a criminal than she is a hero. So her going to Titan made sense. Enceladus came about because I had the image in my head of her coming back to Mega City One for revenge on Dredd and the Council, and I needed to work out a way of doing that. The best characters usually tell you where the story needs to go.

Henry’s art on Titan really was just superb, with a Hershey who just bristled with pissed off authority in practically every scene. And then there’s the fabulous colouring throughout, including those really striking pages shot through with red emergency lighting. And that image on Dredd on horseback – a nod to Miller’s Dark Knight?

RW: I think Henry said to me at one point that he fancied drawing Dredd on horseback. I’d written a sort of “phantom” horse into my Dredd story ‘The Man Comes Around’ that RM Guera drew so beautifully. So bringing the horse back at the end of Enceladus – like a symbol of Dredd at the very end – that felt really exciting. Taking Dredd to some primal, guttural place. The subjective walls of reality kind of crumbling a bit.

Henry Flint: I prefer Ronin to Dark Knight. That’s his real masterpiece. There’s a horse in that one too!

Henry, with a story such as Titan (and ‘The Small House’), how do you approach it? 

HW: I know Titan is a thriller so I can throw away my cartoony style. Rob writes Dredd with a bit of noir I think it’s fair to say. ‘What would you do if you were Dredd’ type thing. So mood, lighting and lot’s of what-the-hell-do-I-do-now close ups are very important. 

Having worked with a lot of Dredd writers over the years, how do you describe Rob’s writing of the character? 

HF: Rob is a great writer to work with, not only the where-will-this-go plots but also the emotional description of panels which fires me up. You could read his scripts without artwork and enjoy them just the same. I need to know what happens in this current story arc so pretty much gripped when an episode pops up in my email. 

How does the creative collaboration work between you and Henry?

RW: I send the script to Matt Smith. Matt usually offers a note here and there – and they’re usually very good ones as Matt absolutely knows Dredd’s world. But for the most part he doesn’t meddle too much. I think, as we’ve been doing this for a while now, there’s a degree of trust. Then it goes to Henry and often the next time I see it is when it’s in the prog. Matt and Henry have both been doing this so long now, there’s a wonderful machine-like quality about it all. And it works.

Rob, your Dredd writing career began in 2007 and, as with all new writers on Dredd, your first excursions into MC-1 were short pieces. Since then you’ve also been responsible for longer form tales, specifically Titan. Is there a different writing mindset you need to get into when doing short and long Dredds? The economy of storytelling?

RW: The short ones really lend themselves to three act structure. You need a strong high concept. Pages 1-2 will be setup/the world in flux. Pages 3-4 is a goal that needs achieving and obstacles in way. Then a twist, and then a resolution. I enjoy writing them. they’re tight. Get in, get out, no fat on the bones.

Longer ones, the structure can get more fluid, but I do try and stick to that basic template in those six pages. The one regret I usually have is that you have to cram so much into a 6-page Dredd that each page ends up being five or six panels and you don’t get the chance to let the visuals breathe as much as you like. But I do think it’s a page count that leads to a lot of bang for the reader’s buck. You can often get what would be a 20-page story in US comic formats into a 6-page Dredd.

I think the most interesting Dredd stories usually say something about him. If he’s just the cipher/robot – OK, you can have some fun. But there’s not going to be the same character depth or resonance. Wagner did both things so brilliantly, and still does. He can do that fun, quirky, madness of the city thing and he made Dredd this three-dimensional man who could sometimes surprise you. It’s what’s going on below the surface with Dredd that makes him fun to write. Because he’s immensely stoic, and may just offer one word in dialogue but he’s feeling all these things beneath.

That’s why artists like Henry, Chris Weston, and D’isreali are godsends for the writer in this world – so much of writing Dredd is subtext. He says one thing and we know he wants to beat you death below the surface.

Would you agree that, by having these short form Dredd tales, the comic manages to avoid the issues of overly complex continuity found in the Marvel/DC universes and makes it easier for new readers to simply jump into the world of Dredd without hours of extensive research?

RW: Matt Smith’s very good at holding it all together. Dredd’s fairly glacial in continuity shifts but they do happen. And the turnover of new stories by new teams necessitates a ‘you only have to know the basic setup to get this.’ We don’t, by and large, have the big writers’ room conversations regarding Dredd’s world. The only time I can recall something of that was when Day of Chaos happened and Matt sent me and a bunch of Dredd writers some documents that stated Wagner was about to kill off the majority of the city and our stories would need to reflect that. And even that can be summed up pretty quick.

One advantage of the short form Dredds, I’d imagine, is that you don’t necessarily have to concern yourself too much with what other writers have going on. No matter what the disaster that may befall Dredd in a mega-epic storyline, he’ll still always be out on the streets stopping the petty crims and dealing with the weird shit that MC-1 throws up.

RW: That’s largely true. It’s a combined effort from a number of writers. John Wagner still rather owns that world. The big moves are his to make. And rightly so. I remember wanting to blow up Titan at the end of Titan and Matt wasn’t sure because “John might have plans for it.” i argued that the ending needed the stakes. That other writers have to be able to move the world forward somewhat, and we did it. Again, Matt’s the arbiter. He keeps it all running smoothly, week on week.

But, when it comes to creating long form Dredd tales, the writer’s job is a lot harder, I think. With several writers contributing Dredd stories at any point, the bigger storylines have obvious ramifications and require careful planning. And one thing I think happens is that you all carve out your own little Dredd empires, so to speak – there’s Michael Carroll with MC-2, the Sov Sector, Judge Joyce, Judge Dolman and you seem to be casting something of a ring fence around Titan, the SJS Dept, SJS Judge Gerhart, SJS Judge Pin, Judge Smiley and much of the Wally Squad

RW: There’s no ring fence as such, i think it just happens naturally. We all have our own characters and we know them and they suggest certain storylines. Gordon Rennie has a few too. Again, it’s sort of Matt’s role to ensure that no one steps over any lines. If I did have a story idea regarding, say, Dolman, I’d certainly drop Mike a line to run it past him.

Rob, one of your highest profile Dredd tales thus far was ‘Closet’, which garnered a lot of mainstream media attention for its storyline. How did the storyline come about – wake up one morning with the image of Dredd fitting right in at a gay club, perhaps?

RW: I felt that gay culture hadn’t been properly represented in Dredd’s world and needed to be. I wanted to do it in a respectful way, and that was pretty scary to write, as I’m not gay and didn’t want to fall into lazy stereotypes. But i also didn’t want it to be over-earnest. It needed to have the Dreddworld sense of comedy and satire. So that was the line to balance. I think we did it pretty well. The idea of a gay club where people just dress as Dredd was sort of a knowing wink at how bondage-y the Judges can look. The fetishism of the big macho male figure. It drove some rather small-minded readers crazy, which was nice. But at its heart it was about this one kid trying to come to terms with his sexuality. And Dredd and the Judges didn’t arrest anyone for being gay. They arrested people for impersonating Judges.

When did you first discover comics, and what were the comics that made you fall for the artform?

HF: My first comic was Jack and Jill when I was 3-4 years old then later had a big thing for Buster, Whoopee and Whizzer & Chips, I’d buy them and others alternately. Then went through a MAD magazine phase and after that got into European and underground comics, incredibly difficult to get any information about in those days. No computers back then you see. It wasn’t until a visit to Forbidden Planet when I was 14 that I discovered American comics and thought perhaps I’d been going in the wrong direction. No idea why I fell for comics, they just made sense. 

RW: I honestly can’t remember. Someone gave me some DC comics – All-Star Comics with the JSA (I still have the issue, although the cover never survived) and an Adam Strange Justice League issue. A Neal Adams Green Lantern that, again, has lost its cover. A neighbour from up the road would give me her son’s Victor book for boys every week when he’d finished reading it. I’d read Roy of the Rovers, Whizzer & Chips, and eventually 2000 AD. I sort of always remember loving comics.

And similarly, when did you first pick up a 2000 AD?

HF: It was Prog 1, 2 and 3, then a big gap. Mum thought it too violent, tee-hee.

RW: My first weekly ordered Prog was the Ezquerra one with Dredd and the Fatties ‘Umm. Synthi-sausage’… What was that? ’83. So I can’t say I was there at the start. My mate Martyn was getting Starlord and I have very vivid memories of reading Ro-Busters and Strontium Dog round his house.

What was it about 2000 AD that really turned you into a fan?

HF: You know those little boxes which read ‘Thrill 4’ with a picture of a gun or a dinosaur underneath, those. A perfect hook! Massimo Belardinelli and Kevin O’Neil were my favourites in the early days. 

RW: The enormous amount of hyper-violence. That’ll turn a 12-year-old’s head.

Was there a moment you thought “one day I’ll be in 2000 AD rather than reading it”?

HF: Yeah, when Liam Sharp started drawing for the comic and I thought wait a minute he’s only a few years older than I am.

RW: It was never my plan really. I was a freelance journalist in my mid-twenties with no real definite thought of trying to write comics for a living. I sent off a couple of Future Shock ideas. Got turned down. But growing up, it never struck me that it was even possible to be a comic writer for a living.

Can you give us a little insight into how you broke into comics?

HF: I first worked at King Rollo studios colouring animation cells. Then a few comics for Tundra which saw print in Heavy Metal magazine. Then worked for Marvel UK on Death’s Head and four issues of Kill Frenzy which never saw print due to Marvel UK’s cut backs. Then with a reasonable portfolio moved onto 2000 AD.

RW: I went to my first comic convention at Bristol because I lived there at the time. Saw an advert in the local comic shop. Probably Forever People up on Park St. I’d written a script for what would become Cla$$war. Full script, no pitch. I had no idea. I gave that to Com.X at the convention and a few months later they rang and said they wanted to publish it. After Cla$$war came out, I was at a comics drink up in London and Andy Diggle was there. He said “you should be writing for 2000 AD.” That was my way in.

It’s Thought Bubble this weekend, with the two-day comic convention taking place 22-23 September across Leeds City Centre.

And, just as we have every year for many years, 2000 AD is running its new writer and artist talent search, a unique opportunity for new writers and artists to break into the house of Tharg.

Writers have the chance to pitch their idea for a Future Shock to a panel of 2000 AD superstars and a live audience, while artists get the opportunity to have a live art portfolio session.

Richard Bruton sat down with one of the most successful writers to have won the coveted prize, Rory McConville.

McConville won in 2015 with his pitch for Tharg’s Future Shock: Lifosuction that was published in Prog 1972 of 2000 AD, featuring art by the 2015 art portfolio winner, Joe Palmer.

Since then, McConville has been a regular in 2000 AD and the Judge Dredd Megazine, with strips including more Future Shocks, Tales From The Black Museum, Devlin Waugh, Cursed Earth Koburn, and he’s one of a new breed of writers on Judge Dredd.

Rory, going back to before your 2015 win of the 2000 AD writer search, how did you hear about it and what convinced you to enter?

Rory McConville: I saw it on the Thought Bubble website — I’d been aware that 2000 AD did a competition at Thought Bubble but I believe it had previously just been for artists. If a writer’s one had been around earlier, I would’ve definitely applied. It seemed to be the best avenue to get into 2000 AD.

What did the competition win and getting that first 2000 AD credit with your Future Shock mean for you?

RM: Winning it was hugely validating and felt like a lot of hard work had paid off. Future Shocks have such an iconic place in comics that it was a great thrill to be able to write one. I was really happy with how the story itself turned out too. Joe Palmer — who won the art competition that year — did a fantastic job on it.

As for the competition itself, can you tell us a little about the actual process of entering, the preparation involved and the terror of pitching in front of the judging panel of experts?

RM: Basically, you go in and pitch a Future Shock in under two minutes in front of an audience and a judging panel.

As far as my own preparation, I’d been working on a few potential ideas in the run up to the competition and had only settled on the Lifosuction one the Monday before Thought Bubble. In the week leading up to the competition, I practiced reading the pitch a lot, mainly to time myself and get a better feel of the rhythm. So there was a lot of editing and tweaking in the last few days.

As soon as the con opened, I showed up to the room of the competition because I thought it was going to be first come first served. Once we got in however, it turned out people were being picked at random, which was stressful – not actually getting to pitch would’ve been fairly crushing. Thankfully, I managed to get picked towards the end and once I was up there, the pitch itself went well – though I’m quite glad it wasn’t recorded!

Since winning the competition, your career at 2000 AD has really taken off. How important do you think the competition win was for that and how do you think your work has evolved since winning?

RM: I almost certainly wouldn’t be writing for 2000 AD if I hadn’t won it. I started working on more Future Shocks after the first one, then onto a Tharg’s 3riller, and then gradually worked up to several Dreddverse series, like Cursed Earth Koburn and Devlin Waugh, as well as Dredd himself. Working for 2000 AD has also been a great way of getting myself in touch with other publishers as well, so it’s had an enormous effect on my comics career. Writing Devlin has been one of my favourite jobs. John Smith and Sean Phillips created an absolute gem of a character.

Prior to 2000 AD, I’d been doing a fair bit of self-published stuff and contributing to small-press anthologies. I’d also produced two all-ages graphic novels focused on Irish history. One was Big Jim: Jim Larkin and the 1913 Lockout, which was illustrated by Paddy Lynch. The other, illustrated by Deirdre de Barra, was Brian Born and the Battle of Clontarf, focusing on the Battle of Clontarf in 1014.

As for how my work has evolved, being able to work across stories with vastly different lengths has given me a greater understanding of the form. Collaborating with artists of the calibre that 2000 AD attracts, as well as Tharg, has also been a huge boost for my work.

What advice would you give to up and coming writers and artists about getting into comics in general, and the 2000 AD/Thought Bubble competition in particular?

RM: My general advice to all creators would be to start small and make sure you get stuff finished. I self-published a lot of short comics early on to help me improve my storytelling.

I’d encourage anyone who wants a career in comics to go for the Thought Bubble competition. I know it’s terrifying but there’s no better opportunity than this, and if nothing else, it’s a great way of getting feedback. Practice as much as you can beforehand. I’d suggest reading your pitch aloud as much as you can to get comfortable with it, and also in front of people who’ll give you honest feedback.

In terms of story ideas, read over as many older Future Shocks as you can to make sure you’re not retreading old ground. Try to focus on an idea that’s action oriented and visually-engaging. Make sure your protagonist wants something. Avoid “virtual prison” twists at all costs!

There’s some great resources online and in print as well. Karl Stock did a great article in Judge Dredd Megazine #398 about writing Future Shocks and Alec Worley and Rob Williams both have great resources on their respective websites as well.

Finally, what’s coming up for you in the near, or not so near future?

RM: There’s a few Dredds on the horizon in the Prog and the Megazine. I’m working with some great artists like PJ Holden, Dan Cornwell, Clint Langley and Jake Lynch among others. I’m also doing a new Future Shock and a Tale From The Black Museum.

It’s Thought Bubble this weekend, with the two-day comic convention taking place 22-23 September across Leeds City Centre.

And, just as we have every year for many years, 2000 AD will be running its new writer and artist talent search, a unique opportunity for new writers and artists to break into the house of Tharg.

Writers have the chance to pitch their idea for a Future Shock to a panel of 2000 AD superstars and in front of a live audience and artists get the opportunity to have a live art portfolio session.

Richard Bruton sat down with Tom Foster, winner of the 2013 2000 AD Art Portfolio Competition to talk about what the win meant and where it’s taken him. Tom’s first 2000 AD work, off the back of his win was the Tharg’s Terror Tale: Done Deal, written by Alec Worley and published in 2000 AD Prog 1886. Since then he’s gone on to co-create and illustrate the first Storm Warning series in the Judge Dredd Megazine, written by Leah Moore and John Reppion, as well as having his art on Dredd and Sinister Dexter.

How did you hear about the 2000 AD talent search and what convinced you to enter?

Tom Foster: In 2011, the first year I entered, I was shopping myself around all the major UK conventions, trying to get noticed by a publisher. At the time, the competition had no advertised prize other than precisely that – the undivided attention of Tharg and his council.

When approaching editors or other artists at conventions, I often got good advice, but it was difficult to get an idea of precisely where I stood. So the competition, such as it was at the time, seemed like a good way, not only to be seen, but to get a sense of how I compared to those similarly willing to take the time to enter. Disillusionment or encouragement were on the table and either one seemed worthwhile, in its own way. By coming runner-up, I got a little of both.

Then, the following year, with the prize of a paid, published strip having been announced – and the person who beat me to winning line presumable disqualified from doing so again – the list of incentives was long enough to give me the motivation to try again.

How did finally getting the win at the third time of asking feel?

TF: The world ‘surreal’ is thrown around a lot these days, and probably only really belongs in the province of lobster telephones and melting clocks, but suddenly bumbling into a situation I’d imagined a million times, but never experienced was pretty weird. It seemed oddly in-keeping with my distorted dreams of success that my big break into comics came on a stage, in front of an audience. I’m not known for shying away from attention.

As for the competition itself, can you tell us a little about the actual process of entering, the preparation involved and the terror of pitching in front of the judging panel of experts?

TF: I had already attempted one of 2000 AD’s stock sample scripts before, so had a little bit of experience and the panel were very fair and encouraging. The fact that I came runner up for two years in a row was in equal parts frustrating and reassuring. The real terror was in getting to all the way the venue on years two and three and realising that I might not even get to the final this time. Tharg is an overlord of few words, and I could never tell if I had made a sufficient offering until the word was given.

Since winning the competition, how do you think your work has evolved and where has the competition win and subsequent Future Shock strip taken your comics career?

TF: I can’t over-emphasise the importance of this competition to my career. Since winning it, I have never gone fore for more than a month without a gig. There’s been a lot of changes in my process since my first entry, yet, oddly, it’s come almost full circle; my technique now being almost identical to the process I used in 2011. The quality and consistency of my draughtsmanship has improved a lot since then, so I feel more confident in relying on traditional methods and skills, rather than trying to reverse engineer something from elaborate digital processes.

I’ve turned my hand to Judge Dredd, Sinister Dexter, Bill Savage (sort of) and Storm Warning, which I co-created with Leah Moore and John Reppion. I’ve also done some tutorials for ImagineFX. I dabble in stand-up comedy too, but I’m sure nobody would be interested in that.

What advice would you give to up and coming writers and artists about getting into comics in general, and the 2000 AD/Thought Bubble competition in particular?

TF: I’m still early in my career, with plenty of time to completely ruin myself, so please don’t take my word as gospel, but I’ll try to offer something useful. I’d say it’s really important to nail the fundamentals. Study anatomy, composition, storytelling and anything else that seems relevant, until they’re second nature to you. Style is something that will evolve naturally in your work, rather than something to emphasise in order to compensate for blind-spots in your abilities. If you’re not good at drawing feet, learn to draw them better.

Finally, what’s coming up for you in the near, or not so near future?

TF: I’ll have a new series of Storm Warning coming out early next year (after the estimable Jimmy Broxton puts me to shame on the title for the next few months) and then, who knows? Bee-keeping, boxing, bocce ball – the world is my oyster!

Every year, 2000 AD gives new writers and artists the chance to get their first work for the Galaxy’s Greatest Comic at the annual Thought Bubble convention in Leeds.

Selected by Tharg himself, prospective art droids have their work put before a panel of top artists before one of them is chosen as the winner not only of the competition – but of paid work for 2000 AD! It’s not for the faint of heart but the competition has launched the professional careers of some of the newest talent to grace the pages of 2000 AD!

As would-be droids put the finishing touches to their scripts and art competitions for Thought Bubble this weekend (22-23 September), Richard Bruton chatted to another previous winner about the experience and what it’s meant for them…

Daniel Dwyer won the 2000 AD & Thought Bubble art portfolio competition in 2014 and his artwork graced the pages of 2000 AD in Prog 1932 with the Tharg’s Future Shock: The Big Heist, written by David Baillie.

Daniel, how did you hear about the 2000 AD talent search and what convinced you to enter?

Daniel Dwyer: I sent a submission of several comic pages to 2000 AD a year before I entered the competition at Thought Bubble. Tharg’s reply was short and crisp, mainly criticising my rather overloaded, hard to read panels and the way I inked also could have used some improvement. I always planned to send a subsequent submission but then I read about the competition on 2000 AD‘s website.

What did winning the contest and seeing your work in the pages of 2000 AD mean for you?

DD: It meant a lot. Ensuing from the critique I got, I tried to learn and improve as much as I could during that year until Thought Bubble 2014. And to actually win at the end was just mind-blowing, especially after I saw the other competitors’ works which really impressed me.

Getting my work published at 2000 AD felt simply overwhelming. But as lucky as I felt, when I saw my work right next to the work of professional artists in Prog 1932, I realized how much I still had to learn.

As for the competition itself, can you tell us a little about the actual process of entering, the preparation involved and the terror of pitching in front of the judging panel of experts?

DD: In order to enter the competition you had to prepare the visuals for a Future Shock script which was available via Thought Bubble’s/2000 AD‘s website some weeks before the event took place. Equipped with those pages, at the first day of the main festival, the preliminary round consisted of queuing up at the 2000 AD booth, waiting to get your work critiqued by one of 2000 AD‘s artists. So, standing in line alongside various other attendees, you had enough time to get nervous by looking over your work for the millionth time, noticing what you could have done better.

Jon Davis-Hunt examined my work, being just a real nice and cool guy. He quite liked the perspectives I chose, though he thought them being a bit off here and there, in his eyes they offered a good dynamic feeling. After that there was nothing left to do but to await a message which may or may not permit me to enter the final round the next day!

Finally, standing before the jury, being judged by artists like John McCrea and Chris Weston was quite terrifying but also quite encouraging. Having your work debated on and critiqued during that panel in front of a live audience which could see the pages projected on a big screen, was something surreal. I definitely would have felt devastated if the experts simply would have disliked my work. But it became an insightful discussion about page-layout and the art of leading the reader’s eye by means of composition, implied movement or usage of negative space. Overall, it was just a great experience, one I’m still treasuring.

Since winning the competition, how do you think your work has evolved and where has the competition win and subsequent Future Shock strip taken your comics career?

DD: I think my work has evolved quite a bit, not least because of the advice I got. After winning the competition I drew two stories for the Zarjaz fanzine. The latter one, a Judge Hershey story, I’m feeling especially content with. Also, the enriching experience I made during the competition led me to seek out other contests. So the following year I won the Top Cow/Image talent hunt as well. Other than that, I’m currently collaborating with some authors who have read the Future Shock strip and thereby took notice of my work.

What comics or other art work have you done since the competition and Future Shock and what’s coming up for you in the next year?

DD: Other than what I’ve already told, I’ve worked with a couple of authors on several stories which got stuck in the pitching phase. Apart from that, I did the art for a Top Cow Darkness issue. Besides comics, I’m also making single piece drawings and recently got into screen printing, which is quite fun. A few years back I did animated experimental short films, – some of which are quite embarrassing and others I consider odd but interesting on an aesthetic level.

Right now I’m working on a self-written comic I’m planning on publishing on my website and Instagram in the hopefully not too distant future, presumably early 2019. Besides that I’m collaborating with another artist on a making-of book about a sci-fi movie that actually never existed, for which I’m delivering character designs, vehicle concepts and storyboards.

What advice would you give to up and coming writers and artists about getting into comics in general, and the 2000 AD/Thought Bubble competition in particular?

DD: During the competition the examined main aspect was to evaluate whether you could tell a story or not. So I would advise to study and analyze how your favourite stories unfold visually, structurally and rhythmically over a certain amount of pages, converting the story’s time into expanded plane space. Keep an eye on what is shown, what is left out, and what is indicated and left to your imagination between the panels’ cliffs. Of course being good at drawing stuff like cool spacecrafts, dope combat suits and rock-hewn chins will always be hugely and utterly significant! Just make sure your panels correlate with one another in versatile ways that suit the narration.

Other than that, it’s easier than ever before to get in touch with people and publishers. Seek out critique and show only your best, most recent body of work. Don’t waste your or anyone else’s time by showing work you know you already could do better. I’ve done that in the past, being unsure about the number of pages I should pack into my portfolio. It feels impolite and uncomfortable listening to somebody who is trying to help you by giving advice on matters you already figured out for yourself. Reflect on your work, find out what aspects of sequential storytelling fascinate you and work from that knowledge onward as your creative basis.

When did you first start reading 2000 AD?

DD: I grew up in a rather small town in Germany where it was impossible to get any 2000 AD progs at that time. During my early teenage years, now and then, there were translated paperbacks of collected Judge Dredd storylines like America or the Dredd/Batman crossovers, and Block Mania and The Apocalypse War at my local library. All strictly Dredd, which was great, but I missed out on quite a lot. Especially the art by Arthur Ranson on Button Man and Judge Anderson, which I encountered some years later, and would have loved to experience earlier.

And if you had the chance to work on a dream 2000 AD strip or character, what would it be?

DD: Mega-City One. This behemoth of a city is a character of its own, multifaceted, beautiful and ugly at the same time. Blade Runner on steroids. Some time ago, D’Israeli wrote an interesting piece on his blog on this city’s varying appearances over its multiyear history and through various artists.

And finally, what artists do you count as influences on your art?

DD: There are way too many artists and writers who influenced me and whose work I adore. For the sake of brevity, I’m just listing artists who had an immediate impact on the way I wanted to draw since I was a young teenager: David Mazzucchelli for his overall diverse and dynamic storytelling, character- and mechanical designer Yoji Shinkawa for his mastery of brush and ink, and John McCrea for his talent to convey animated and varied characters. Artists like Moebius, Goseki Kojima, Katsuhiro Otomo and Arthur Ranson influenced me a few years later.